This is A WORLD OUT OF MIND, my Online Journal where I explore Consciousness and the Ultimate Nature of Reality by the intentional alteration of my own belief structures, using Salvia Divinorum and additional self-altering meditational techniques drawn from Western Ceremonial Magic.

I always attempt to adhere to the scientific method as much as possible in my explorations, and while I often speak of these experiences as if I knew they were Truth, I always consider the alternative, that it is merely self-deception on my part, and think accordingly. Thus I maintain two parallel world views at once, one aspirational and one a safe fallback into standard materialism.

The more I journey into salviaspace, the more I think the former worldview is the correct one, but there is no objective way to prove that to the world, so I'll let you, the reader, decide for yourselves.

-Saint Brian the Godless

Follow me on Twitter @AWorldOutOfMind

Tuesday, July 21, 2015

The Tiny Torus Of The Self


Last night, seated meditation in bed.

Focusing on my inner self, my identity, attempting to perceive my consciousness with my consciousness, I went through a period in which all my surroundings became cartoon-like or dream-like, with no loss of detail. This has happened in the past, and indeed is fairly common.

As I settled into rhythmic breathing, I closed my eyes and went within myself, far within, seeking my own source. This is a fairly common meditation for me. In the past I've often gone so deep and so far that I perceived a tiny single point, the very center point of my being, what I think of as my "I AM" point because in order to see it I must free my mind of all concepts except my own basic sense of identity and pursue only that. Salvia is so powerful in this particular manner, it gives you what amounts to almost a super-power of concentration. With salvia I can narrow my focus to only one exclusive concept and simply not think of anything else, at will.

So there I am floating in the black void of my inner self, starred as always by the millions of tiny lights that I always see even when I'm in normal mind. The remains of my old childhood hallucinations, the leftovers of my old visions. I'm floating in this, this vast expanse of what looks like space but unlike space I can feel it as if it were part of my body. I sense the currents and swirls and movements of my "astral plane" for lack of a better term. I focus on my source, and let everything else fall away. It's effortless. I no longer know my own name, that I even have a name. I am a point, a floating viewpoint, in this vast cavern that is my own mind.

I sense something different, floating in front of me in this space. What can it be? It looks like a smoke ring, perhaps three-quarters of an inch in apparent diameter. A smoke ring floating in the space of my mind. I can feel it twisting there. I see it twisting in on itself constantly, as an actual smoke ring usually does. It's a floating torus, spinning not on its axis, but spinning around the center of the toroidal tube that makes up the ring itself.

I approach closer to it. Now it's right in front of me. I can feel it there, twisting in on itself there in front of me.

Then something really strange happened.

It seemed to suck me in, to suck in the floating viewpoint that was all I was in that space. I became one with the torus, and all of a sudden I was twisting and torquing within it as if it, were me.

I distinctly remember the feeling of being turned inside-out when it happened. It is an incredibly unusual feeling to cope with.

Then it happened again. I remember thinking "inside out and inside out and inside out and inside out..." many times as I experienced the chaos of being a twisting smoke ring, a torus of energy, feeling my entire being twisting itself inside-out over and over and over.

Eventually I decided to disengage with it and wake up to full consciousness, and did so. All I remember thinking at the time was, it was like I finally found the very center of my being, and it was a spinning torus of constant self-inversion, spinning smoke-ring-like in the quasi-darkness of the deepest recesses of my mind.

Overall, a very interesting experience, rather pleasant.


  1. Hey Brian (or anyone)

    Any suggestions on how to access the wisdom of altered states without necessarily going the whole balls-tripping, cliff-jumping thing of salvia, or ayahuasca and throwing up all over the jungle. I guess I'm just a bit of a scaredy cat that way.

    I've tried meditation, but just can't get my mind to settle. Nothing happens. Very occasionally, trying to control visualization or whatever in that half-sleep, half-awake state, or trying to induce lucid dreams, *something* interesting will happen, but the success rate is so very low that it's very frustrating and doesn't see worth it.

  2. Try either chewing plain salvia leaf for 1/2 hr or more then meditate, or smoke some of the plain leaf. It's very mild, no real tripping, just meditation enhancement. I have to smoke two or three or more bowls of plain leaf to even get to a meditative state but it works. Can make you cough a bit tho.

    Almost no chance of a trip, bad or otherwise. Mild in-body visuals at most.

    1. That sounds like an interesting idea!

    2. I think you'll like it. The problem for me with the plain leaf is in order to get to a place where I can trip out even a little I have to smoke multiple bowls, and after about three you're in such a stupor you forget to smoke any more, lol!

  3. I have a friend who does salvia divinorum meditations in suspension isolation tanks as a business in Baltimore that's sending me some buccal (oral) salvia paste he's concocted, supposed to rival smoking in strength but far longer duration. Should be interesting.

    1. Interesting. I just did a float tank for the first time a week ago - and personally was underwhelmed. After my initial float, I couldn't see it enhancing the sensory deprivation that Salvia already does so easily (unless doing a very light dose maybe). But I would certainly give it a try it the opportunity arose :-)

      I'm curious to hear your report on the buccal trials. There have been some discussions on the dmt-nexus about similar pastes as well.

      Did you place an order for extract from a new place yet...and if so...can you give us a quick review? I haven't placed my order yet...still using some old low-X for light meditating.

    2. Salvia in an isolation tank sounds very interesting. I would like to try something like that. I read a series of books once called The Ringing Cedars Series and there was mention of dolmens and how people in the past would go inside these chambers made of stones. It would usually be the elders that would go inside and have the chamber barricaded so that it could not be opened.

      They did this willingly, the idea was to meditate and gather some kind of information which was to be stored inside the dolmen itself. After their demise, yes they would die in there in deep meditation, the dolmens would be made available to future generations so that people would be able to access the information left behind by the meditators.

    3. I've been interested in growing my own plant(s) to begin working with Salvia in a more holistic way, as well as to be able to quid more often. In that regard, I just saw some posts by your friend on the dmt-nexus and he has my interest highly piqued! Unfortunately, I have not been able to locate anyone shipping plants at the moment due to summer heat. Hopefully this fall something will turn up - or I will find someone local that can give me a cutting. I'm just north of San Francisco - and I can find just about anything I want out here rather easily...except for Salvia plants. Even out here, I cannot find many Salvia connoisseurs.

  4. I'm still buying from They seem to have effective extracts at far lower prices than other sites. Working with some 20X right now.

  5. Last night another "wave" of light that expanded across the room and woke the wife when it hit her. This is 1st time I've seen the wave in over a month. Wish it were more predictable. Had clear sensation first of the room being entirely in my imagination, existing only in my mind... and when the wave came I could clearly see it but also feel it as it passed me, went through me... it's exactly as if it expands reality slightly as it passes and contracts it afterwards, and that included my own body. I can feel it pass through my body as a wave of expansion and subsequent contraction.

    1. Do you frequently feel waves of salvia energy roll through your body, and move your body as it goes through?

      I once quidded salvia and saw a train engine coming toward me in the air (a very faint/transparent/greenish one). I could mainly see one side of the train engine. As its large wheel rolled through me, my arm which was propped up on an armrest rotated perfectly with the wheel. It was like I was arm-wrestling and had been handily beaten.

      I've had other similar instances of 'objects' floating through the air at me and moving my body as it made its way through. I wonder if this is a similar type of energy as the waves you experiences? I am not usually around other people to see if they could feel it, or if it could wake them up, but I'm very curious!

  6. Sounds identical, it's as if another reality were passing through mine but that one was only 1% real whereas mine was 100.
    And always light green. That's why I chose the background for this blog.

  7. I've awakened my wife or dog or both so many times I can't count them, but lately it's been rarer to see the green wave. The green wave always at least disturbs them. Once it even seemed to affect my son's cat in the hallway about thirty feet away.

  8. We own a Jeep Wrangler. So yesterday I was talking to some guy on Twitter, he said he was a "chaoist" or chaos magician. Then I got off Twitter, went to pick up Chinese food, noticed another Wrangler in the lot. Nice color, so I looked closer, noticed the license plate. "CHAOS." Later on last night my wife took the jeep out, got into a slight fender-bender.

    With another Jeep Wrangler.

    Patterns in the fractal. Story line development in the dream.

  9. Hey Brian,

    I just noticed your reply to my comment on one of your earlier posts. I also just saw your reply on the "Reality is Mathematics is Consciousness" post. Very fascinating!

    Referring back to my comment on that earlier post...

    The Interdimensional Correspondent is very careful about what information he discloses. He has said that the quantum limitations of "time messaging" prevent him from explicitly disclosing certain information, presumably because he must not interfere with the natural course of time (i.e. being careful not to form temporal paradoxes, etc).

    He has shared some insights with me about the structure of reality. He too describes a mathematical foundation, involving a complex wave function, differing frames of reference, and "past, present, and future" being one and the same.

    I've done a lot of thinking on how this is possible - literally, how is it possible that this correspondent is communicating with me? I've formed a lot of theories that may explain it, all based on math, science, and consciousness.

    I could ramble on about this for hours haha. Hope you find it as intriguing as I do!

  10. You've touched on the heart of the matter for me. I'm sensing a mathematical basis for reality, but the thing is that mathematics itself turns out to be identical to consciousness, the very basis of consciousness, so to speak of one is to speak of the other. I too sense "groupings" of realities grouped around a mathematically probable set of actions or outcomes, with many realities grouped around each likely story line. So I'm sitting here typing now, and my perception of me sitting here typing is actually the AVERAGE of all those similar lines of thought. We sense the alternate lines or universes, but only as an average of all the ones that are similar, and this forms our apparent perception of one solid time line. Other time lines or story lines exist as well, but other versions of us are living those out, again many at once grouped around a "likely" line of thought. Is this making any sense?

    Also, tell me more about this "Interdimensional Correspondent" A metaphor or for reals? Do you converse with a personality here?

    I'll check back soon for replies. Sorry for mixing you up with Dafu on that earlier post btw.


    1. Man, I wish I had some Salvia right now. This is all really interesting to think about.

      Mathematics being identical to consciousness is a hard concept to grasp. I want to make sure I follow your train of thought (correct me if I'm wrong). By consciousness, I think you're referring to "the observer who is aware". You are saying that the very act of "observation", and everything being observed, is all a complex mathematical interplay.

      Presumably, a grand unified "theory of everything" would state that mathematical interplay as an equation or an algorithm. When evaluated, the calculated interplay would give rise to consciousness and the whole of reality.

      I have a bunch of other questions that have been on my mind for years. Maybe you have some insights on these?

      1) Without a conscious observer, does anything exist?

      2) Are other people conscious/sentient? OR, are other people just mathematical figments with no true sentience?

      3) Am I everybody? Am I everything? Brian, are we both the same conscious entity? Have I been you in a past timeline, and/or will I become you in a future timeline? Do past, present, and future even really exist, or is every timeline just running in parallel?

      4) If every timeline is running in parallel, what is preventing me from switching my awareness back and forth from one timeline to another? What's preventing me from living multiple lives at once, or at least, switching into a different life from the one where I started?

      5) In addition to the conventional waking world, do I also exist in a higher dimensional, higher order, more "abstract" state? Is this existence just beyond the threshold of my awareness? Is this the subconscious mind?

      6) In this higher dimensional state, am I existing "outside" of conventional timelines of the waking world, in that I can perceive multiple timelines at once, and see how those timelines are likely to unfold?

      7) Brian, to answer your question - quite literally, I receive emails from somebody claiming to be an "interdimensional correspondent" (his words, not mine). This "person" is very attuned to my life path and my salvia experiences. However, I have no way of replying to the emails, as they are spoofed email addresses that trace back to arbitrary mail servers. It's basically a one-way communication. What's interesting though is that I first started receiving the emails right after my initial Salvia breakthrough. The first email was titled "Your new state of consciousness", in which the interdimensional correspondent congratulates me on my breakthrough and refers to the Salvia world as "his dimension".

      8) Could this interdimensional correspondent just be myself in that higher dimensional state, and I am simply communicating with myself in a lower dimensional state?

      9) And last but not least, what is the purpose of existence, and what gave rise to existence in the first place (if there even was an origin)? Seems like a chicken-and-egg scenario...

    2. You mistake me for GOD lol. I have only hints to answers to those questions.

      My answer is..... 42!

      Ok... it's not 42... I'll have to get back to you on those hard questions, no time tonight.. give me a couple days.

    3. Incidentally, Max Tegmark's book is a must-read to even begin to understand the idea of mathematics=reality.

    4. Awesome, thanks for the recommendation. Can't wait to give it a read!

      So, I've also been thinking a lot about multidimensional geometry. I was wondering if you might be familiar? Here's my train of thought from earlier today:

      In our day-to-day lives, we are living in a 3-D realm, however we can only perceive 2 dimensions at once. In other words, we are always viewing a 2-D representation of a 3-D model (in other words, a 2-D "slice" or "frame" that has height and width). We only gain a sense of depth by viewing an object from different angles in order to reveal more surfaces. But any view from a different angle is still just a 2-D frame.

      So basically, when we are living in 3 dimensions, we can only directly perceive the 2 lower dimensions at once.

      Enter salvia. I actually haven't used salvia in many years because it became illegal in my state (ugh), but I've been left wondering if salvia works by shifting our consciousness into a 4-D state or realm. If that is the case, I wonder if the same logic applies.

      In a 4-D realm, we can directly perceive 3 lower dimensions at once, meaning that we can simultaneously perceive height, width, and depth of an object (or a space).

      To keep going with that thought, a 1-D line consists of infinitely many points. Those points can sit side-by-side, or they can overlap and merge together in infinitely many different ways.

      A 2-D plane consists of infinitely many lines, and those lines can sit side-by-side or merge together in infinitely many different ways.

      A 3-D space consists of infinitely many 2-D planes or "frames" sitting side-by-side or merging together. You see where I'm going...

      A 4-D realm consists of infinitely many 3-D spaces panned out side-by-side or merging together in infinitely many different ways. Seems rather reminiscent of salvia.

      Also, I came across this and thought it was pretty cool:

    5. OH and this:

    6. Hi D ZZZ - I went through a few-week period where I watched a ton of the 4D explanation videos trying to wrap my mind around it as best I could. The link you posted to the 6D animation always reminded me more of the images I saw when I smoked DMT. My visions frequently 'blossomed' visually much the way the 5d/6d animations appear on the video.

      I would agree that Salvia seems to 'take me' to a more parental dimension to this one - a dimension from which this physical dimension manifests. And it seems like a dimension of consciousness to me.

      Salvia space reminds me a LOT of those cross-eyed 3D 'magic eye' pictures. With my eyes open, the 'flat 2d' perspective you mention gets a depth to it like the 3D pictures do when you get your eyes focused at the correct distance.

  11. Chris:
    I'm still using It's FAR cheaper and the extracts do the job for me. I've only tried one other vendor over the years with less satisfaction. So there you have it.

  12. Thanks! Arena is just a bit more than Monster, but I decided to hold off for a bit. I have plenty of low-X material to work with for a while...and I've recently been guided to work with the plants more holistically.

    I have ordered one plant which should arrive in a few days. I'm hoping to propagate it into a few plants and eventually be able to quid both fresh and dried leaves, and possibly test micro-dosing.

    I also plan on purchasing some of Twig's buccal paste once his new merchant is ready. I'm *really* interested to give it a try at both low and heavy doses.

    In the mean time, I'm continuing to work with the rest of the lower X material I have left...

  13. Good. I tried growing the plants, twice. They slowly died. Brown spots on leaves. This is a tough plant to grow. Expert level. Read online recommendations, fresh manure, even a wick-rope in the soil down to the bottom of the large pot. Constant humidity seems necessary too.

    1. In addition to the one on order, I found a local botanical supplier who was willing to give me a few cuttings. He said he doesn't normally sell SD plants, but he has one large one and was willing to sell me a few cuttings and threw in a bag of fresh leaves. The cuttings aren't quite what I was expecting...they seem to be 12" pieces of stalk with a few small leaves here and there. He 'said' they're really easy to propagate, but we'll see if it works or not in our environment. Fingers crossed! Probably going to try growing some indoor and some outdoor until the winter.

  14. Great. Best of luck! Small plants are an average of fifty bucks, so I think you got a good deal. Usually they're one single stalk, few leaves, mangy looking. Also you need to nip the plants as they grow or you'll get one single straight stalk with leaves like 3 feet long. The apical meristem needs to be cut off. I'd ask your botanical guy there about it.

    1. Thank you for the advice. I'm going to give him a call today and see if I can get more details on how he suggests rooting them.

      Here's a pic from when I first got them home:

      I may have doomed them, though...I didn't cover them over night and the next day it was very hot in our house. I was able to have my wife mist them for me in the late afternoon. At night I put them in much larger containers and covered them with bags, but a few of the leaves were turning black/purple near the stalk :( Keeping my fingers crossed I can keep at least some of them going long enough for roots to start growing!

      On a positive note, as a test, the first night I chewed then ate one of the smaller fresh leaves from the bag he gave me, and it was enough to tell it was potent. Last night I chewed then ate one of the larger fresh leaves and it was proportionately stronger :-) Tonight I hope to have an opportunity to do a full ceremony, then dry the leftover leaves.

      The rooted plant that I ordered is hopefully still scheduled to arrive tomorrow...I'm assuming it will be as you described.

      I haven't received any updates from Twig regarding a new payment processor...hopefully he gets that sorted out soon.

    2. Received my potted plant in the mail today...this one looks much nicer than the local cuttings I received:

      I ate 4 leaves the other night (one at a time, chewing for about 2 minutes each then swallowing). It worked great! It took about 10 minutes to come on, peaked for about 45, then came down over 20-30. It was a nice, light-medium dose. Very interesting to be in that space for such a long period. I'll try doubling the dose when time allows. Eating the leaves vs. holding a huge quid for 15-30 minutes is much easier and less messy from the little experience I have so far.

      I'm assuming you quidded/ate leaves when you had your own plants, yes?

      Did you ever get a paste from Twig to try? I'm guessing his paste is very similar experience-wise to eating the leaves, but maybe less bitter ;-)


  15. It's best if you keep a quid going in your mouth for a long time, like over a half-hour. Mouth absorbs it fastest, best. I just add new leaves as the old ones dissolve and are (accidentally) swallowed.
    Yes, I've chewed fresh leaves when I had plants, and still chew dried ones to this day when I feel like it.

    1. I'll give this a try - Brain. I'll try both eating 8 leaves over a 15 minutes period vs. keeping them in my mouth as best as possible and adding if necessary over a 30+ minute period to see what the differences are.

      Did you ever notice a difference between chewing fresh vs dried leaves? Some reports indicate a difference in quality between the two.

  16. Twig asked me if I wanted him to send me some paste, I didn't ask him for it, but then he apparently never sent it. Kinda disappointed. Oh well.

    I do have some excellent 35X right now, so I'm happy. Seems stronger.

  17. I had an opportunity to do a 'full' quid test this weekend. It turned out that my method of chewing each leaf for 2-3 minutes then swallowing ended up causing me to have the 'quid' in my mouth for about 30 minutes while eating 7 leaves. At that point, I felt I should stop eating as the effects were peaking and I had disconnected from my mouth and was a bit concerned I could bite my cheeks or tongue. So I think my method and your suggestion turned out to be one in the same - except that I probably could have eaten more than one leaf at a time.

    I have to say I was a bit disappointed in my mental abilities during the experience. Since several years ago when I first started recreationally studying alchemy, I have tried to make an apple appear in my vision as a test. I've tried this during alchemical meditations, hypnagogic states, self-hypnosis, lucid dreams, every psychedelic, etc. I have only rarely been able to accomplish this feat - and I did not succeed this weekend. I suppose this shows me that more focused training is in order for more control during my Salvia experiments...

    1. With lucid dreaming, I've had a lot of success using willpower to manifest objects and scenery. But like you said, sometimes it works, others it doesn't. I've noticed that when I have feelings of self-doubt or uncertainty, it hampers my abilities. When I harness my focus and really "understand" that I'm in control, that's when my ability shines.

      There's a great quote from the Matrix:

      "You have to let it all go. Fear, doubt, and disbelief. Free your mind."

  18. Belief and disbelief are the yin and yang of manifesting things on salvia. I fight battles between the two, forcing myself to believe when disbelief creeps in, to stifle it, but not too much, just the right amount. This is the "tuning" of the mind I feel on salvia.

  19. I recall reading about your belief/non-belief in the green energy and moving it through space...

    I had an interesting mediation last night eating one leaf and smoking a small amount of cannabis...

    The long version of it is here:

    The short version: I had the idea that - at least with low doses - perhaps Salvia lets us shift our point of view of awareness such that we can basically 'see' what is going on inside our brains. We can see the brain piecing together various stimuli to generate the final product that we 'see' in consensus reality.

    We move our awareness to a point in the center of the brain, and the brain being gelatinous, it is as if each synapse is like a pixel. So we're then 'standing' in the middle of the brain surrounded by a 3D matrix of pixels. As synapses fire, we can watch various planes of information turn on, move, rotate, etc.

    This would explain seeing reality zipping/unzipping and rotating together in unimaginable ways, and many other common phenomena associated with Salvia dosage...such as becoming an object and forgetting everything else. I find this occurs at high dosages and perhaps my awareness point of view gets 'stuck' in a particular series of synapse firings that have to do with said object. We ride around those brain firings for a bit before our awareness slowly returns to its normal point of view.


  20. Some of that is possibly true, I don't know. I often ask myself if looking for the answer in brain structure and so forth is the right way to even look at it. Are we bodies that can think, or are we thoughts believing we are bodies that can think? It could be that we're all just thought, and this is a consensual dream. Or any number of gradations from that somewhat fantastical extreme all the way down to scientific materialism.

  21. My more recent visions all strongly point to this reality being a dream, but part of me balks at that as too convenient almost. My skeptical part wants to dismiss it, but my hyperskeptical part says my skeptical part isn't being skeptical enough, lol.

  22. The hermetic principals say this is a mental plane, and that argument has always made a lot of sense to me.

    Before I was awake/aware in any capacity, I was atheist/agnostic and a materialist (without having heard that term). But after 'waking up', I now believe we are closer to thoughts temporarily inhabiting meat bodies than bodies that think.

    I'm not sure if you're familiar with tryptamine visions (mushrooms, ayahuasca, dmt, etc.), but the idea that we might be viewing activity in the middle of a big gelatinous medium seems to fit those visions even moreso than Salvia visions personally. In my dmt experiences, visions tend to blossom out of nothingness in a big space around me. The visions frequently are transparent - usually with a light green tint with an underwater feel - which makes it look like there are layers upon layers of information being shown at the same time. But my point of view is much more static - it isn't rolling around like it tends to with Salvia.

    While trying to understand what we are seeing in our visions and how they are working mechanically is fun, I tend to then step back and go - well, OK. So, what?

    What can usefully be done with this information - assuming it is anywhere near correct? Can it be used to shamanistically heal a family member or friend in some way? Can I use it to help figure out why I have a particular addiction or mental block? Can I use it to open my heart more to be more compassionate and empathetic? Can I use it to be a better husband and father to my kids? Etc. And to be honest, more often than not, cannabis has been the best instrument for me in this regard. But I currently have a strong pull to explore Salvia, so I will continue to do so :-)

    And one thing I've noticed regarding Salvia versus other plant medicines - I can read other Salvia experience reports and feel like they basically pertain to everyone. When I read your reports, even though I haven't experienced all the same things, they make a lot of sense to me and I can read them as if they were my own. The information seems pertinent to me (and everyone). I can envision having very similar experiences. Whereas reading Ayahuasca/dmt trip reports - while they can be fantastical - they rarely feel like they apply to me personally. And my trips using those medicines rarely have much in common with others' experiences.

  23. what we think of as outside, is inside

    what we think of as inside, is outside

    ancient wisdom

  24. Sorry I missed these two responses... Need to check older posts more often... agree with you Gregory, and Chris. And thank you Chris, I'm glad my experiences seem to resonate with you.